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fendre
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 27, 2011 7:32 pm    Post subject:

I have a good historical knowledge of this age, and I also live near to the austrian border in hungray, so I might have an austrian accent bump
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Da Bozz
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 28, 2011 10:48 am    Post subject:

fendre wrote:
so I might have an austrian accent bump


Or a funny accent like most of the Hungarians I heard lol ... do you speak good German? Razz
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fendre
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 28, 2011 4:25 pm    Post subject:

Yep dont you believe me? Crying or Very sad
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Da Bozz
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 28, 2011 5:58 pm    Post subject:

fendre wrote:
Yep dont you believe me? Crying or Very sad


We will see. Mr. Green

I will listen to all your examples and then I'll make my decision. Devil

btw I'm Austrian (seriously!). Razz
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caveman909
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 28, 2011 11:00 pm    Post subject:

living in greenland?^^
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 29, 2011 10:53 am    Post subject:

caveman909 wrote:
living in greenland?^^


Read my profile - I'm enthusiastic seal hunter, but in Austria we don't have any seals (except in the zoo, but I'm not allowed to hunt them).

So what to do?
Living in Greenland! lol
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 07, 2011 6:26 pm    Post subject:

Good day. I can draw avatars and icons, may try to draw some textures. Also I know a bit history so I can help the project in that way. Also I may try to make maps for single player. Thank you for abilities given to me. If you are interested contact me: alagaesua@gmail.com. Smile Smile
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 08, 2011 5:39 pm    Post subject:

I have sent you a mail yesterday. Smile
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PostPosted: Sat Jul 09, 2011 10:29 am    Post subject:

Hi everyone

This post is posted to show Tilanus that I'm ready to research. My task was to make the Vlach natives more historic.

Exclamation Under construction -- I'll delete this line if its not Mr. Green Exclamation

Vlachs are a large ethimology on the Balkan, nowadays their population is about 25 million. They mostly live in Romania(20 million), Moldavia(3,5 million). The remaining population is scattered across the balkan.

First of all, the soldier(s) able to replace vlach pikemen. I've collected several units, so it's possible to choose of them.

Because in the Napoleonic ages, Vlachs mostly lived in Romania's Wallacia region and Moldavia, I've chosen soldiers from the Wallachian military(otherwise, most of the Balkan was under Turkish rule, so didnt have so much military strength).

Units

1. Wallachian Calarasi horsearcher

Good ingame names instead of horsearcher(for the request of Tilanus):
Spoiler:


-Cavalry archer
-Mounted archer
-Bow rider
-Mounted bowman



First appeared in the Medeval age, they were the primary forces of the Wallachian army until 1600, although they were commonly used later as well. They carried Wallachian Composite bows(Wallachians were the masters of bows) nad sabres, sometimes lances. They wore little to no armor, and were able to fight both mounted and dismounted. They got land for service, therefore they were always avaiable.
In equipment and appearance, the Vlachs were similar to the Hungarians and Russians; they wore large fur capes decorated with feathers, and sported the characteristic long, rounded beards. After their victory over the Turks at Calugareni in 1595, Vlach armies became almost completely cavalry forces. Several contemporary engravings by de Bruyn, made between 1575 and 1581, help us to reconstruct the appearance of the Wallachian cavalrymen.

They belonged, for the most part, to a type of light cavalry (calarasi), who acquired much of their equipment and equestrian skills from the Ottomans. Besides training their horses to walk, trot and gallop, the Vlachs taught them to walk like camels, moving both legs on one side at the same time. Today one can find horses walking that way, but it is considered a bad trait.

From the end of the sixteenth century, Wallachians served as mercenary horsemen to both the Ottoman Empire and its enemies - Poland, Hungary and Russia. They were organized in squadrons (sotnia, from the Russian word for 100) of about one hundred men. At one time there were 20 sotnias in Polish service in the Ukraine, and one of the frequent motifs on their flags was a bull's head. Like the Ottomans, they refused to use firearms for a long time; their main weapons were spear, sabre and composite bow. For protection, they wore mail shirts and used a light round shield.

Spoiler:







2. Seimeni(=lefegii) musketeer(singular is seimen)--http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Seimeni

They were mercnaires fight in large numbers in both the Wallachian and Moldavian army in the 17-18th century. They had muskets, and wore mostly no armor. Seimeni (plural of Seimen) designates the group of flintlock-armed infantry mercenaries charged with guarding the hospodar and his Court in 17th and 18th century Wallachia and Moldavia. They were mostly of Serb and other Balkan origin.

The designating term is of Turkish origin: seğmen means "young armed man". In modern transcriptions of Slavonic, it may also appear as simén (plural: siméni) or siimén (siiméni).


Spoiler:




Possible units

These units werent used so commonly, or a bit archaic, although I included them so you can choose from these as well.

1. Curteni
Not armored cavalry that was mostly used in the medieval ages, and occessionally in the 1500 years. They fought from horseback with lances or bows. Exclamation They are a bit archaic, therefore not recommended

See cavalry in the upper line:



2. Panduri

Used from about 1700, and reorganized in 1806, they fought in Large numbers (50000) in the Russo-Turkish war. Their colthing was like the same to other this-aged soldiers(like Hajduks or seimeni).


Exclamation Hajduk is also used at another mod, as Tilanus mentioned, so if you need another soldier like this, I higly recommend Seimeni(see upper) Exclamation

3. Hajduk(http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hajduk_(soldiers))

The word hajduk entered the Polish language from Hungarian in the late 16th century. It was initially a colloquial term for a style of footsoldier, Hungarian or Turco-Balkan in inspiration, that was introduced by King Stephen Bathory in the 1570s, and who formed the backbone of the Polish infantry arm from the 1570s until about the 1630s. Unusually for this period, Polish-Lithuanian hajduks wore uniforms, typically of grey-blue woollen cloth, with red collar and cuffs. Their principal weapon was a small calibre matchlock firearm, known as an arquebus. For close combat they also carried a heavy variety of sabre, capable of hacking off the heads of enemy pikes and polearms. Contrary to popular opinion, the small axe they often wore tucked in their belt (not to be confused with the huge half-moon shaped berdysz axe, which was seldom carried by hajduks) was not a combat weapon, but rather was intended for cutting wood.

In the mid 17th century hajduk-style infantry largely fell out of fashion in Poland-Lithuania, and were replaced by musket-armed infantry of Western style. However, commanders or hetmans of the Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth continued to maintain their own liveried bodyguards of hajduks, well into the 18th century as something of a throwback to the past, even though they were now rarely used as field troops.

Spoiler:



See left infantry:

Spoiler:






Spoiler:



4. Puscaasi(or Dorobanti)(Hungarian:puskás=rifleman):
Infantry musketeers/ fusilers inherited from the XVIIth century. See other pictures for infantry stereotypes.

Spoiler:

http://www.twcenter.net/forums/picture.php?albumid=4431&pictureid=49954



5. Dragonii (drăgani in Moldavia) - dragoons of western inspiration, trained to serve both on horse and on foot. The former category of mazili/mazâli (medium cavalry of noble descent) was transformed into a new light cavalry type responsible with guarding the supplies&army camps and securing the communications during the wars.

6. panţârii (probably an inspiration and adaptation from the Polish armoured XVI-XVII century hussars), which were considered effective especially against the Tartars and until towards mid-XVIII centry were organized as armoured (long mail coat, metal helmet) cavalry

Techs


First, I put here my opinion of the existing techs(thanks Tilanus for the list)

1. Morlach shepherds: Historically good, Morlachs were truly shepherds(who often held their sheeps in their houses). Also, they were quite agressive people. In the Napoleonic times, their estimated population was about 150000, therefore they could fit NE.

In-game: I also suggested a Shepherding tech, so the best would be to let this tech stay, or replace it with Wallachian shepherds.

2. Suditi : True, in the late 18th century, Suditi was "avaiable".

The Sudiţi were inhabitants of the Danubian Principalities (Wallachia and Moldavia) who, for the latter stage of the 18th and a large part of the 19th century — during and after the Phanariote period of rule, were placed under the protection of foreign states (usually the Habsburg Monarchy, Imperial Russia, and France) as reward for particular services or in exchange for payement. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Suditi)

In-game: I think it is good to have them in the game, because they really fit the 1500-1815 times.

3. Heirs of Dracul: Well, this is the tech that could not fit the NE, because Dracul(Vlad Tepes) ruled in the mid-15th century, so it's too early. Also, because Vlach pikemen will be replaced, their in-game use is also questionable.

In-game: I think this should be replaced with one of the techs listed below

I've collected several techs, which are really Wallachian. I'll recommend and in-game use for them, but you can change it. Choose the best 3 of them.

1. Wallachian sheperds(only include, if you want to change it to Morlach shepherds)

Many wallachians were sheperds in these ages, so I recommend this tech from them.
In game use: You might get some sheeps(this is my best suggest)

2. Cereal harvest

Cereals were growed in wallachia in large amounts.
In game use: Might be farm gather incrase, or less farm cost

3. Puscaasi tufecci(this tech should be only used if the new Vlach unit is puscaasi)

Puscaasi tufecci was a subtype of Puscaasi, who were better payed, and used in smaller numbers, although they fought better.

In-game use: Possibly Puscaasi build limit decrased, and their attack/HP increased, as well as their cost.


I have these ideas yet, although I might edit this post if I find anything else.

I hope this will be enough to show the History's importance for me.

Sources(If you can't find anything written upper at these links, just ask)

http://www.twcenter.net/forums/album.php?albumid=4349&pictureid=49633
http://www.warandgamemsw.com/blog/466026-wallachian-cavalryman-c-1575/
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Seimeni
http://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?49685-OiM-Balcan-factions/page2

Thanks for reading this Mr. Green
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PostPosted: Sat Jul 09, 2011 12:45 pm    Post subject:

fendre wrote:
Hi everyone

This post is posted to show Tilanus that I'm ready to research. My task was to make the Vlach natives more historic.

Exclamation Under construction Exclamation

Vlachs are a large ethimology on the Balkan, nowadays their population is about 25 million. They mostly live in Romania(20 million), Moldavia(3,5 million). The remaining population is scattered across the balkan.

First of all, the soldier(s) able to replace vlach pikemen. I've collected several units, so it's possible to choose of them.

Because in the Napoleonic ages, Vlachs mostly lived in Romania's Wallacia region and Moldavia, I've chosen soldiers from the Wallachian military(otherwise, most of the Balkan was under Turkish rule, so didnt have so much military strength).

Okay.

Quote:
The best of them

1. Wallachian Calarasi horsearcher(my suggest)

First appeared in the Medeval age, they were the primary forces of the Wallachian army until 1600, although they were commonly used later as well. They carried Wallachian Composite bows(Wallachians were the masters of bows) nad sabres, sometimes lances. They wore little to no armor, and were able to fight both mounted and dismounted.

A mountable/dismountable horse archer (like Partyzant) with variable equipment. Although I see that you chose this unit cause it is obviously representative, I'm missing a key characteristic here. Why are they so good? How have they been used? What's their history? Any remarkable events/battles?
They're obviously scratching the timeline, but I can't work with this unit because it's still nebulous in spite of the name and equipment.

Quote:
2. Seimeni musketeer(singular is seimen)

They were mercnaires fight in large numbers in both the Wallachian and Moldavian army in the 17-18th century. They had muskets, and wore mostly no armor.

Are you talkin about Seymen (click) at any chance? I haven't found anything about 'Seimen'

Quote:
Exclamation From this point, units below not really fit in NE, or were not widely used, so you can ignore them. These were mostly used in the 1500 years, so they might be a bit archaic.

Possible units

These units werent used so commonly, or a bit archaic, although I included them so you can choose from these as well.

Are you serious? You haven't found unique units after 1600?? Yomgui found this page and it offers some interesting units indeed: http://www.twcenter.net/forums/showthread.php?t=305935

Try to avoid the chance that I get the impression that you're in favor with units that have had their prime time in 1400-1550 (so BEFORE our timeline).

Quote:
1. Curteni
Not armored cavalry that was mostly used in the medieval ages, and occessionally in the 1500 years. They fought from horseback with lances or bows

These units refer to financial status of the people, so I think because these "levels" didnt changed so much after the Med. ages.

1. Strajeri

The poorest soldiers, armoured lightly, armed with bows, axes, spears and pikes, they were occessionally used in the 1600 years as well.

2. Mosneni

They were the middle soldiers, who could afford good armour and weaponry. This was the largest Wallachian financial "level". There was some kind of "conscription" in the 1400 years. They were occessionally used in the 1500 years as well. They foght both on horseback and dismounted with swords, axes or bows.

Okay, same procedure. You provided the name, the equipment and the rough timeline. See above for what kind of information is missing.


Quote:
Techs

I've collected several techs, which is really Wallachian. I'll recommend and in-game use for them, but you can change it. Choose the best 3 of them.

Okay, but that is just the half of the given task. You were also supposed to check what's currently in game and validate it or not. That's completely missing here.

Quote:

1. Wallachian sheperds

Many wallachians were sheperds in these ages, so I recommend this tech from them.
In game use: You might get some sheeps(this is my best suggest)

Yes, I remember something like this as a concept or already realized tech.
Sheeps are good.

Quote:
2. Cereal harvest

Cereals were growed in wallachia in large amounts.
In game use: Might be farm gather incrase, or less farm cost

Possible and working, but does not look that attractive.

Quote:
3. Composite bows

Wallachians were the masters of bows, so we could include them as a military upgrade.
In game use: Possibly archer attack/range incrase, or cost decrease

The composite bow is an ancient weapon, I don't see how this should be something "new" to any of the Great powers played by the player. Also, it just could improve archer units (whose amount will be reduced drastically), so this tech is too specific if its purpose is to be an improvement. It could only work as unit shipment, but would then again need a completely new name and is thus a completely new tech.

Quote:
4. Lex Antiqua Valachorum(or ancient Wallachian law)

These laws contained data about taxation, work hierarchy, gathering, etc. The first codexes were released in 1640s, contained these laws. These laws were not only applied for the romanians, these were commonly used in that region.
In-game use: There can be many possible uses of these laws, e.g. gather increase(both from mills and plantations), might be Vlach soldiers' HP/attack increase, or cheaper unit or economy building costs.

That information is too rough. It'd have been interesting to know what this law makes so interesting in the historical context. It's just about a lot of things and thus just a book about law like any other. This would need to be more specific so that I can deduce a direct advantage for players.

Quote:
5. Cultural influence

Many sheperds reached far distances such as Pindus and Caucasus mountains. During their "trip" they left parts of their culture at the crossed regions, making a vlach cultural infuence in many things, sometimes including languages.

Ingame use: I don't really have an idea, might be unit HP increase or faster gathering.

I have no idea either. Great cultural influence is hard to catch with a tech effect.

Quote:
6. Supplex libellus valachorum( or Petition for Romanians of Transylvania)

This is the name of two petitions sent by the leaders of the ethnic Romanians of Transylvania to the Holy Roman Emperor Leopold II, demanding equal political rights with the other ethnicities of Transylvania.
These 2 petitions were sent in 1791&1792.

Ingame use: I have no idea, might be something with gatherers(HP increase/gather rate increase Confused )

Well, it'd have been interesting to know what the response was to that? It's pointless making a tech out of something without any great resulting effect. What you just told me is: Two persons sent a letter to one person. End of the story. Now that's not really offering anything? [irony]Or shall this be a suggestions for introducing postmen?[/irony]

Quote:
I have these ideas yet, although I might edit this post if I find anything else.

I hope this will be enough to show the History's importance for me.

Thanks for reading this Mr. Green

Okay.

Let me finally come to the bottom line now:
  1. You were leaving out many many relevant information: IMAGES Exclamation, SOURCES Exclamation and KEY CHARACTERISTICS Exclamation (see above) of the suggested units.

  2. You were neither proving nor comparing the current Vlachs in NE with anything. This was your task too!

  3. I highly doubt there are no interesting Vlach units after 1600, you need to improve your googling skill.

  4. Your techs don't really have names, you need to make them more specific. You can even give them a native term if this seems to be the only way (but this is the last last last! option).

    Everything unique in history or everything unique of anything mostly gets a single UNIQUE term that describes this, you need to look for these terms and use them as tech names. By doing that you prove that your research and the following tech was hitting the nail on the head.

  5. The formatting could be better, you should consider making a formatting pattern for unit suggestions or technology suggestions providing the key information in a set shape. Consider keys like usage, time used, historical importance, images, etc.


Finally I need to admit that none of the suggestions neither convinced nor even catched me. But don't get me wrong. Maybe you suggested really good stuff, but the way you present it doesn't give me that impression at all. So you need to improve your presentation skill.

I think there are some more flaws, but I think you'll be busy enough to fix just the points that I told you. You get some more time to correct that, cause I saw in our Skype conversation that you're eager to do this. The faster you're finished now, the greater will be your chances to become a researcher for NE. I won't give you a concrete deadline, but just tell you that the concept about Vlachs that you might present within the next week has to fulfill all criteria. If you present something like a repitition of the just provided level of (low) quality, then I can't really accept you as researcher.
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fendre
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PostPosted: Sat Jul 09, 2011 3:29 pm    Post subject:

I'll edit the original post soon
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PostPosted: Wed Jul 13, 2011 10:59 pm    Post subject:

Better, but the techs are still poor, uncreative and very bad (sorry, but that's just the case). I've just done a fast research to get an impression, there is quite a lot that def. has potential.

Just a tip: Look for Vlach personalities, events and governmental structures, they often provide images of units and/or interesting links to further topics. I've been finding plenty of them.

Techs can cover elements of almost everything (culture, technology, politics, military, economy, etc.) - also on very large scales (i.e. an important town, a duchy/state, ethnicity, whatever.. ), you need to abstract an in-game use/effect on your own then.

You also don't need to be too strict about Vlachs, you can include Moldavia too (changing the name of the natives is not a big deal, i.e. into Danubian Principalities or whatever is correct here). The idea of the Vlach natives is to cover and represent a large part of the Balcan civs, so if you recommend a better name, say it. Everything is discussable.

Some quick notes: Your picture of the Vinatori/Vanatori is not appropriate. I guarantee you that this image shows units from the 19th century, prove the dates! I've also found exactly the same image in a higher resolution (prefer pics with high resolutions - they're the best drafts).

The Hajduk is already in use as future mercenary ( http://media.moddb.com/images/mods/1/11/10405/Hajdukclean.png ), however, this type of unit is highly attractive. See if you can find similar units or different types of Hajduks (they differ a lot in appearance at least..). Check if it's worth and justified maybe having two different types of Hajduks (or hajduci).

I can't go into further detail, cause I'm very busy with learning for an exam on friday. So you'll get a final statement about the researcher job at the end of the week. Use the time, you've made some progress, but there are still lots of flaws and holes to fill.

Improve the formatting of your post (consider the full potential of the text editor), try to find more images and maybe more units, but especially concentrate on more and better techs.

Also: Next time please don't edit your original post, but make a new one, I want to compare and see the changes.
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 14, 2011 8:55 am    Post subject:

Ok, was primarily working on units until now, I'm now focusing on Techs

Good luck at the exams Smile
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 14, 2011 2:17 pm    Post subject:

i am enjoy that post Mr. Green
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PostPosted: Sat Jul 16, 2011 2:06 pm    Post subject:

@fendre: I explicitely told you not to edit your post, but to make a new post. Gnnn! Nevermind, I'm going to answer that post today or tomorrow.

Edit: A lil tip too: Once images are very large, better put a link to the image instead of an image as my screen explodes whenever I open a spoiler.

The calarasi names are bad, they're only descriptive, but have no character. A good unit name is a name that everybody associates as easy as possible with the correct unit. Now there are technically thousands of Bow riders etc. - fix it.
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PostPosted: Sat Jul 16, 2011 7:22 pm    Post subject:

Ok, now correcting the final bugs and adding more techs--in a new post Mr. Green
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