Chasseurs and Grognards

 
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Napoleon V
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 18, 2015 2:55 am    Post subject: Chasseurs and Grognards

Good Morning All,

I've just updated to the new 2.1.7b version and I must say that so far it is amazing. However I'm having an issue training Grognards and Chasseurs at the Academy where it now says "An additional (blank) is required to train another Chasseur/Grognard" has anyone else encountered this issue?
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Tilanus Commodor
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 18, 2015 6:32 am    Post subject:

Hey Napoleon V, welcome! Yes, it's a known bug and will be fixed next version, Suggestions for alternative Chasseur and Grognard training welcome. Wink
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 18, 2015 8:47 pm    Post subject:

Isn't it shipments missing? Haven't played the French in ages, but I know that those units used to cost some fraction (which was the odd bit) of a shipment.
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Napoleon V
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 23, 2015 2:46 am    Post subject:

Thanks Tilanus, I just didn't know if I completed the install properly. On a side note I played my first game as the Germans since the update and I don't think I've ever enjoyed a game as much as playing as the Germans with those unique Reichstag armies. Great Job guys!
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NapoleonicWololo
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PostPosted: Mon Sep 28, 2015 8:12 pm    Post subject:

Hi, newbie here, so maybe my idea won't fit/ won't be made easily. You asked for suggestions about Chasseur and Grognard Training, and i've got one : how about removing the shipment cost, making them the price of a standard musket/grenadier (accordingly), but giving them a global eco penalty ?

Lemme explain : for each Chasseur/Grognard you currently have, you get a global (e.g.) -1.5% gather rate on all your Sansculottes. As they are elite units, you could consider it a 'logistics penalty', (that could later be removed by a University tech for EVEN MORE Powerhouse French lategame ?)

If you keep them idle (for massing), as you train them by batch of 4/5, you get (at least) a 6% penalty for keeping them, making them a "go hard or go home" unit type.

Feel free to tweak the numbers, just an idea Wink

EDIT : Oh and, as a first post, good job guys, I re-enjoy a game I forgot, and it's all thanks to you guys. Great work.
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 30, 2015 8:23 pm    Post subject:

Hello and welcome!

Lose the shipment cost - absolutely agree.

Global economic penalty instead of balanced resource and population cost - I don't agree at all. Too complex, too unique, too confusing.
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NapoleonicWololo
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 03, 2015 9:41 am    Post subject:

Hi, thanks for the reply.

The idea behind this was to punish you hard for massing them, because I think that's when the Chasseurs/grognards are a problem.

A high cost may be a good short-term solution, but the Cuirassier IS super expensive, and a lot of players seem to complain about them (I won't because I f***ing love them Razz )

This said, giving them a high cost (50f50g per population cost => 100f100g for a Chasseur, and 150/150 for a Grognard ?) and limiting their number to a singe batch (ie. 5 Chasseurs, 4 Grognard at max) with eventually a University tech to lift this limit higher, could work imo.

This, or a fire pit to produce them like Skull Knights (just to see the Sansculottes dance ! )
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 05, 2015 11:32 am    Post subject:

Yes, I think that would be a more reasonable approach.
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Napoleon V
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 08, 2015 3:08 am    Post subject:

Thanks, I thought the shipment thing was pretty good. I actually got it to work by producing them in my houses instead by modifying the proton file
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Kyle Ludwig
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 15, 2015 4:58 am    Post subject:

So, how are those unique frence units be produced before the ongoing bugs are fixed?
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 17, 2015 9:34 pm    Post subject:

Napoleon V wrote:
Thanks Tilanus, I just didn't know if I completed the install properly. On a side note I played my first game as the Germans since the update and I don't think I've ever enjoyed a game as much as playing as the Germans with those unique Reichstag armies. Great Job guys!

Thanks a lot! I put a lot of efforts into it. You're welcome. Cool

NapoleonicWololo wrote:
Hi, newbie here, so maybe my idea won't fit/ won't be made easily. You asked for suggestions about Chasseur and Grognard Training, and i've got one : how about removing the shipment cost, making them the price of a standard musket/grenadier (accordingly), but giving them a global eco penalty ?

Lemme explain : for each Chasseur/Grognard you currently have, you get a global (e.g.) -1.5% gather rate on all your Sansculottes. As they are elite units, you could consider it a 'logistics penalty', (that could later be removed by a University tech for EVEN MORE Powerhouse French lategame ?)

Uh, that's neither really possible technically nor easy to grasp/communicate. I'm completely with SAOL on this. Too complex and confusing.

Quote:
EDIT : Oh and, as a first post, good job guys, I re-enjoy a game I forgot, and it's all thanks to you guys. Great work.

Thanks! I'm particularly happy about getting people excited about AoE again with the mod. Smile


NapoleonicWololo wrote:
This said, giving them a high cost (50f50g per population cost => 100f100g for a Chasseur, and 150/150 for a Grognard ?) and limiting their number to a singe batch (ie. 5 Chasseurs, 4 Grognard at max) with eventually a University tech to lift this limit higher, could work imo.

Wow, that's kinda cheap. Razz Build limit is the way to go, high pop could work, but I'm not a great fan of it for infantry units.

Quote:
This, or a fire pit to produce them like Skull Knights (just to see the Sansculottes dance ! )

lol, what French dance would that be? Razz On a more serious note, spawn over time coupled with slightly increased pop could be the only way to offer Chasseurs and Grognards that works. On the other hand, I've hated these auto-spawns already the Ottomans, so not gonna happen.

Kyle Ludwig wrote:
So, how are those unique frence units be produced before the ongoing bugs are fixed?

The most plausible alternatives to me are:
  • via tech in the University just like the other elite units
  • via homecity
  • trainable in barracks/university/whatever with strict (but possibly increasable) build limits

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NapoleonicWololo
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 18, 2015 12:12 pm    Post subject:

Hey, thanks for the replies.

About your Shipment idea (i'm kind of an idea-box, so if there is too much don't hesitate to tell me) : French have this "All Xbows become Skirmishers" card. You could apply the same reasoning, but population-wise : All Cuirassiers become Grognards, all Hussars become Chasseurs. That would bring a huge tactic advantage (instant countering of anti-cavalry armies, intenstification of an ongoing raid) as well as a HUGE mindf*ck for the opponent.

Might be a little OP though. Maybe a food/coin cost like Old Han Reforms ?
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 18, 2015 9:55 pm    Post subject:

Tilanus wrote:
lol, what French dance would that be?


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4Diu2N8TGKA

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PostPosted: Sun Oct 18, 2015 11:27 pm    Post subject:

Thank you for the reply.

I am thinking of an idea for a better may to deploy those unique units.

Would that be possible to unlockable by using the university tech, then it can then be increased the quantities by using capitol?

Just a thought Razz
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