Many suggestions to NE team
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meta_knight25
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 06, 2016 12:23 pm    Post subject: Many suggestions to NE team

Many suggestions for futures versions of NE Mr. Green .Give me your opinion for this suggestions. sorry if my English isn't understandable.


General:
-more tiny map
-improve nr build zone
-+2 build limit for twc barracks, tower, blockhouses and asian castles.
-royal guards improvement to be easily to get
-able to all civ to build TC with villagers
-grenader and cavalery archer improvement
-All pets (including disciples)get +15%HP,ATK at each age
-All pets get *2 bonus attack versus artillery
-TWC market producing 0,5 Wood per second but they got build limit=5(for balance vs factories)
-TWC civ get -40% train time of military units in age IV
-much hc cards aren't use by players ,it can be good to fusion 2 cards to one. It can be use too because NE civs have a lot of goods cards and the choice is very difficult.





Spanish:
-missionary -1 pop(=+10 pop in battle)

Portugueses:
-enable to build fish caser(1 Food generation per second) in water (max6 for 500 Wood and 450HP)



Ottomans:
-imperial janissary train time -20%
-mameluks in saloons


Swedens:
-torps can shoot units (10 attack with bonus like tower)
-nerf producing of torps -0,5 generating
(buged design for musketeer with the upgrade in age IV not the guard ,if you delete the upgrade of units after the guard please keep the name and the design ^^)




Russians:
-blockhouse +10 pop
-oppichnik in 10 build limit on stables
-mandchus in saloon

Indians:
-mansabar urimi able
-mansabar units +25% hp
-rapjoute fix attacks vs building and improve them in battle
-jat lancer, incendiary in saloon
-dutchs in consulate

Japaneses:
-monks can train varans (max 12, for 50 Food )(all twc and tad civ get pets trainable by explorer)
-shogun can train ninjutsu zukai for 300 gold and hatamotos samourais 400 gold


Chineses:
-iron soldier in saloon

Sioux:
-they can have technologies of cree, commanches and cheyennes on ambassadies
-add wall age2(without upgrade)
-dog soldiers in stable(max 5 for 300 Food )
-begin with 5 bison
-tepee generating 0,2 Coins per second

Aztecs:
-begin with an ara =hot ballon
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Silmariel
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 06, 2016 5:08 pm    Post subject:

My thoughts:

-grenadiers should (and will?) be redesigned anyway.
-prices for RG-upgrades should stay but access to RG should be balanced. I still favor not more than 2 RG units/civ.
-Cavalry archer will be available from age II, so they already have a bonus compared to dragoons. If something should be changed than it's range I guess (or maybe rateoffire). 14+2 instead of 12+2 range would be a good change because unlike goons they cannot hit&run.
-TWC shouldnt play a big role in NE anymore
-fusion cards is not a good idea, generally speaking as this would lead to op-shipments. Still, NE introduced a few "standard" shipments but only NE civs have access to them. Normal European civs should have them as well.
-consulate should be skipped entirely (except maybe for a single civ). Asian/TAD civs don't need them, they are already unique/strong enough on their own. Introducing them to even more civs would be a big mistake (also making civs less unique if their unique units are accessible for other civs as well).
-Concerning making specific mercenaries available at the saloon for specific civs (highlander for brits etc.): a shipment should replace the current dance-hall-shipment which makes ronin available for all civs. More suiting mercenaries would be better (stradiots dont fit austria btw. they belong to Italia much more)
-Spahis should not be available at stable but there should be an infinite shipment available.
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meta_knight25
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 06, 2016 7:24 pm    Post subject:

stradiot aren't italians, elmetis are italians.
anyways gernaiders,cavalery archers and royal guards units need to be reworked.
fusion card can work on really bad card like two Advanced cards
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Silmariel
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 06, 2016 8:00 pm    Post subject:

Stradiots come from a part of the Balkans that belong to the Republic of Venice for an important part of NE's timeline. And they were frequently used in wars in Italy. While they didn't play a major role in Austria's military history.
Why do RGs need to be reworked?
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caveman909
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 06, 2016 8:10 pm    Post subject:

Silmariel wrote:

-Spahis should not be available at stable but there should be an infinite shipment available.

There's already one Mr. Green
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meta_knight25
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 06, 2016 8:10 pm    Post subject:

the cost is too big for an upgrade unit
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Silmariel
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 06, 2016 9:35 pm    Post subject:

caveman909 wrote:
Silmariel wrote:

-Spahis should not be available at stable but there should be an infinite shipment available.

There's already one Mr. Green


Actually I checked now and there are even 2 infinite spahi shipments. So no need to be trainable at the stable.

meta_knight25 wrote:

the cost is too big for an upgrade unit


And why is that so?
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Girafarig
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 07, 2016 6:30 am    Post subject: Re: Many suggestions to NE team

These suggestions seem oddly… specific. Anyway:

meta_knight25 wrote:

-more tiny map


I think they're small enough. Learn how to play other than rushing.

Quote:
-+2 build limit for twc barracks, tower, blockhouses and asian castles.


So, basically, +2 on defensive buildings for non-European civs. Sure, whatever.

Quote:
-able to all civ to build TC with villagers


But that diminishes the value of the Explorer a lot. I don't know, I kinda like how important a unit the Explorer is for European civs. Taking away his exclusive right to build TCs turns him into a throwaway unit, I think.

Quote:
-grenader -20 food cost
-cavalery archer +4 attack


These are two very underused units and they're in need of improvement, but I'm not sure these are the changes they need. My main gripe with grenadiers, for example (I train them) is that they're severely lacking in offensive power. And NE adds a couple techs to remedy that, already. I don't play online, so I don't know if people use them in PvP games and, if not, why not.
As for cavalry archers… I'll be honest. Other than Dutch Ruyters, I almost never make light cavalry. Neither archers nor dragoons.

Quote:
-Heavy canon, great bombard, rocket can be train in foundery(max2 for 700 gold and 200 wood )


No. You want more? You get them from factories. And Ottomans have got a church tech and a couple shipments for more Great Bombards, anyway.

Quote:
-All pets (including disciples)get +15%HP,ATK at each age


They don't? I thought they improved, like the Explorer himself.

Quote:
-All pets get *2 bonus attack versus artillery


This benefits mostly the Spanish, who already have an array of options against early artillery. I think it's a bit pointless, to be honest.

Quote:
-TWC market producing 0,5 Wood per second but they got build limit=5(for balance vs factories)


Meh. I hear they're discontinuing TWC civs anyway.

Quote:
-TWC civ get -40% train time of military units in age IV
-TAD civ get -20% train time of military units in age IV


One part of me is totally onboard with this, especially considering how so many NE European civs get instant or near-instant training on at least some unit. On the other hand, I dread the thought of the Japanese traning 20% faster (probably twice as fast, actually, considering other bonii they get) 10 super-pumped up Ashigari musketeers.

Quote:
-much hc cards aren't use by players ,it can be good to fusion 2 cards to one. It can be use too because NE civs have a lot of goods cards and the choice is very difficult.


No. Pick one or the other. I, for example, have a Swedish infantry deck and a cavalry one. You can't have it all – and it's a good thing not to have it all, since it means you get more than one way to play a single civ. It's more replay value for your money.

Quote:
British:
-consulate of common wealth:
higlands:higlanders in saloon for 300 gold
higlanders -15%cost for 750 gold
indians 5gurkhas age2:500 wood
9gurkhas age3:800 wood
12gurkhas age4:1000 wood
(other idéas of bonus for other nations are welcome)


a) Consulates are hard-coded into TAD civs, I think, so it's tricky to give European civs consulates
b) I don't get what any of those bonii have anything to do with having a consulate. Maybe the Indian one – too bad it's the most pointless one, since Brits get riflemen anyway.
c) …but why? No, seriously. Why? Why the need for European consulates? It's historically inaccurate and it adds very little that they don't have, some way or another, already.

Quote:
Spanish:
-missionary -1 pop


I think the Spaniards could use some improvement, but not on the one unit that they can make that's really, really strong.

Quote:
Portugueses:
-explorer +25%HP


More HP for Portuguese explorers? The one civ that gets >9000 explorers? No thanks.

Quote:
Austrians:
-stradiots in saloon
-line infantry + 15%attack


Again, I'm inclined to disagree. Line infantry pack quite a punch, especially considering their bonus against cavalry. Their problem, if any, is that they're really fragile.

Quote:
Ottomans:
-janissary train time -20%
-mameluks in saloons
-spahi on stable (max 5 and for 450 Food )


As pointed out earlier, you already get Spahis –the strongest cavalry in the game, mind you– in infinite shipments.
On janissary training time: in Colonial age, when they're beefed up musketeers, they don't need to come out any faster because they already kick ass. In late game, when you'd need units coming out faster, Janis get barracks building – trading a slower-ish training time for the ability of having more unit-producing buildings closer to the enemy. Again, not a good idea for them to come out faster than they do.

Quote:
Swedens:
-torps can shoot units (10 attack with bonus like tower)
-nerf producing of torps -0,5 generating


Swedish torps are getting redesigned, I think.

Quote:
Russians:
-blockhouse +10 pop
-oppichnik in 10 build limit on stables


Bad experiences with oprichniks, eh?

Quote:
Indians:
-begin with a rhinoceros explorer(=dog explorer)
-mansabar urimi able
-mansabar units +25% hp
-urimi in barracks(max 5 ,each for 220 Food )
-rapjoute +25%attacks vs buildings,+20%hp
-jat lancer, incendiary in saloon
-dutchs in consulate


You get trainable Mansabar units already in a wonder. And Urumis, like Spahis, are a) very strong, and b) available as infinite shipments.
Also, no rhinoceros. You already get two endangered species to explore.

Quote:
Japaneses:
-monks can train varans (max 12, for 50 Food )
-shogun can train ninjutsu zukai for 300 gold and hatamotos samourais 400 gold
-russians and french in consulate


If there's one civ that doesn't need a boost it's the Japanese.

Quote:
Chineses:
-spanish and dutch in consulate
-monk can train pandas(max 3 for 140 Food)
-iron soldier in saloon


Have you seen pandas? They're really hard to train, in that they're not interested in reproducing at all.

That's all I have to say for now.
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meta_knight25
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 07, 2016 8:51 am    Post subject:

I am not a rusher but the NE maps are really big(not all but a lot) and NE isn't only a nr mode we could can rush too



india need to can train 1 mansabar urimi (it's can be active only when you have send the HC car 9urimi +1mansabar urimi)

able to all civ to build tc with villagers>>> because twc and tad civ can build tc with villager.It could don't change value of explorer because if you use villagers they don't get food,wood,gold See villager can builds TP and more explorer builds tp than villagers.

grenader and cavalery archer need improvement , i have just make a suggest of improvement NE team can find better improvement of course

build limit for defensive building can be cool
pets are good only in age 1 and 2 but they are useless in age IV and V

NE is more based on late game and a lot of european civ have instant units
and india,sioux,aztecs,incas,persians, iro and a bit china get really long train time

Jannissary training -20 % is much in beginning but in late it give only -60%(=40%) train time , it isn't toof fast think
standard unit in other european civ hav -80 %(=20%) this want say jannissary take doble time to be train than other infantry unit
it can be good for imperial jannissary

japaneses can train isollasionist units with shogun like shinobi and yamabushi that is why i have think at hatamoto and ninjutsu zukai

missionary -1 pop just= +10 pop in battle

I don't have bad experience withoppri, i love them but tilanus want to delete them because they aren't on napoleonic era that is why i suggest to make a build limit on them because you can't lame a lot with them and they are just accessories to kill building

dutchs have ceylon and trading posts in india and persia
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dutch_India
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Evolution_of_the_Dutch_Empire#Iran

I edit my first post and delete bad idéas
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Ande59
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 07, 2016 10:10 am    Post subject:

Quote:
-cavalery archer +4 attack


I'm assuming you meant the Cavalry Archer that the Russians and Ottomans have?

Interestingly enough... and I'm not sure many people know this, but the Cavalry archer actually fires 2x faster than Dragoons, as they use a bow. Cavalry archers do not need a buff. They have a 30% resistance to all melee damage... so technically they're better than Dragoons at anti-cavalry. (Dragoons have resistance to ranged damage)
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Silmariel
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 07, 2016 12:26 pm    Post subject:

Still, dragoons have much more attack and can hit and run while you always have to engage in close combat with your CA (that's why they have melee resistance after all)-so your CA will die faster even though they have more armor/HP. Also dragoons ranged armor gives them a much more versatile role as they now can also face ranged units such as musketeers and to a certain degree also skirmishers which should be their counter-unit actually. Meanwhile CA gets wrecked even by musketeers. ON the other hand CA is cheaper so I don't really know if they really need a buff. If-I would vote for a +2 range increase. I still feel somewhat uncomfortable when I use them.

PS: I just noticed that aoeIII wikia states that CA are 0.5 slower than dragoons. Could someone check this? Actually it should be the other way round from a historical pov. Gameplaywise both should have the same speed.

http://ageofempires.wikia.com/wiki/Cavalry_Archer_%28Age_of_Empires_III%29
http://ageofempires.wikia.com/wiki/Dragoon
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 07, 2016 11:49 pm    Post subject:

When ever I play aoe3 it seems like ranged cav can always out run hussars and other hand cav by a slight amount.
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 08, 2016 1:06 am    Post subject:

Silmariel wrote:
If-I would vote for a +2 range increase


I believe NE has already increased Cavalry Archers range by 2 (so 14 without the arsenal upgrade, 16 with the arsenal upgrade)

Note: Dragoon's range is 12 (14 with arsenal upgrade) unless you've got the Portuguese card.
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Silmariel
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 08, 2016 9:22 pm    Post subject:

I checked myself and indeed both types of light cav are equally fast (as they should be). Also CA have the mentioned +2 range buff. I guess that simply is an additional undocumented change within NE. But IMO it's a good change.
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Girafarig
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 09, 2016 2:58 am    Post subject:

meta_knight25 wrote:
I am not a rusher but the NE maps are really big(not all but a lot) and NE isn't only a nr mode we could can rush too


I agree that NE maps are huge. But you can use the other maps instead, right?

Quote:
india need to can train 1 mansabar urimi (it's can be active only when you have send the HC car 9urimi +1mansabar urimi)


Oh. Then maybe it'd be a good idea to get the mansabar urimi at that wonder that trains the other mansabar.
How many urumis do you get in a single game, by the way? Since they're a melee shipment-only unit, I don't see how you could mass enough for a mansabar unit to become something really effective.

Quote:
able to all civ to build tc with villagers>>> because twc and tad civ can build tc with villager.It could don't change value of explorer because if you use villagers they don't get food,wood,gold See villager can builds TP and more explorer builds tp than villagers.


But TWC and TAD vills can build TCs because… because of reasons, I guess (?). It's an economic boost for those civs, in that you can build TCs faster and two at a time – but Asian, and especially native civs get a lot less eco boosts overall than European civs. Forcing you to build TCs with the Explorer in European civs, one at a time, it's a good idea from a balance point of view, in my opinion.

Quote:
pets are good only in age 1 and 2 but they are useless in age IV and V


Well, they are pets, after all. Xbows and pikes also suck from age III onward, and you don't see people arguing that they should get a boost. It's a situational unit.

Quote:
NE is more based on late game and a lot of european civ have instant units
and india,sioux,aztecs,incas,persians, iro and a bit china get really long train time


I know, and it's annoying, but the Asian civs get other kinds of bonuses (bonii? I think I used bonii in my last post but now I'm confused as to what's the plural of "bonus"). The Japs get a lot of buffs, for example. It leads to a different style of play, somewhat more cautious than the standard European style of throwing infantry at each other until someone runs out of resources.

Quote:
Jannissary training -20 % is much in beginning but in late it give only -60%(=40%) train time , it isn't toof fast think
standard unit in other european civ hav -80 %(=20%) this want say jannissary take doble time to be train than other infantry unit
it can be good for imperial jannissary


Yeah, but like I said… you can make more barracks. Right there, in the middle of the battlefield (well, maybe a bit further back). You can make five or ten barracks and have a constant stream of units. And you don't even have to send a civilian to build them. And you can build them right then and there, instead of training units back at base camp and wasting time marching them to the battlefield.

Think about it in this way: how OP would it be to have the ability to sneak five janissaries (pretty tough units, by the way – you don't even need to be that stealthy) past enemy lines, drop a barracks and get twenty or so janis before the other guy has the chance to react? Having slow-training infantry makes for a balanced strategy.

Quote:
missionary -1 pop just= +10 pop in battle


It's not a lot, but it's still something. Also, the unit costs 200 resources – and all other units costing as much take up at least two pop slots.

Quote:
I don't have bad experience withoppri, i love them but tilanus want to delete them because they aren't on napoleonic era that is why i suggest to make a build limit on them because you can't lame a lot with them and they are just accessories to kill building


I think there was a proposal that went along those lines. I don't care that much either way, as long as I get instant-training halberdiers and ransack.
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 09, 2016 4:36 am    Post subject: Re: Many suggestions to NE team

Girafarig wrote:

a) Consulates are hard-coded into TAD civs, I think, so it's tricky to give European civs consulates
b) I don't get what any of those bonii have anything to do with having a consulate. Maybe the Indian one – too bad it's the most pointless one, since Brits get riflemen anyway.
c) …but why? No, seriously. Why? Why the need for European consulates? It's historically inaccurate and it adds very little that they don't have, some way or another, already.


I actually want to see consulates on Europan civs. But have another european civs rather than colonies. This means as a representation of historical alliance. Also, Age of Dynasties mod has consulates on every European civs with no problem
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